Make your smartphone marketing videos look more professional. We’re live and going through our step-by-step guide.
If you don’t already have the FREE guide, you can get it here: https://videopowerup.com/free-guide/
Scott: All right, we’re live.
Angela: We are live.
Scott: We’re live again, Tuesday 10:00, and this morning we didn’t finish this set. As you can see we’re in a new sort of location here. We didn’t quite finish the set that we wanted to do. As I started setting things up I realized that things were, not more complicated, but required a little more thought on how to lay things out properly. The goal for us is to create an environment where we can just walk in every Tuesday and everything’s set up. We’ve just got to turn on some lights, get the camera set up, and then go live and it be that easy. Same with all the other videos we need to be recording. We’re going to be recording a lot of videos to help you guys with your marketing videos. We need an environment where we can just walk in and record those videos, so this is pretty good, what we’re doing right now, but we’re not overly happy with the … The background’s kind of …
Angela: It’s meh. It’s a gray, meh …
Scott: It’s meh.
Angela: We’re gonna fix that.
Scott: I mean it’s good because it’s very focused on just us and what we’re saying. There’s no distractions in the background, but we’re gonna spend a little more time and think about the best way to have our little video set. Thanks for joining us today, I can see Amanda’s already watching this.
Angela: Hi, Amanda.
Scott: Good morning, Amanda.
Angela: Yes means there, even though she said she wasn’t going to be.
Scott: Right on.
Angela: Meh. Amanda.
Scott: What are we doing today?
Angela: Well, we’re actually going to go through our video marketing guide that we have. Last week we talked about momentum, getting momentum on Facebook Live videos and how … Kind of things to do to increase people watching, and then we talked about our video marketing guide. Before we do, I really like Amanda’s idea and actually, you know what? It’s funny, Amanda, we talked about that. We talked about having different … Like changing it up, because I mean, prints are so cheap now, so for having a background, having different things and an ocean definitely would be on my list of things to have as a background. Sorry, I didn’t mean to get sidetracked.
Scott: Maybe like a subliminal vision board in the background, like Bora Bora or something.
Angela: Yeah, Bora Bora.
Scott: That would be cool.
Angela: Yeah, Bora Bora. Our video marketing guide, we put this together to help small business owners and entrepreneurs be better equipped to film their videos using their smartphone and have them look more professional. We really just have some tips and we’re going to walk through this guide. It’s sitting on my lap if you’re wondering what I’m looking down, and all the paper noise is.
Scott: This guide, most … A lot of you, I know already have this guide. It goes over just nine steps, nine basic steps to improve the professional look and sound quality of your videos. If you don’t have this free guide yet, you can grab it from our website. You just go to videopowerup.com, and there’s a registration where you can register and download that guide right from there. If you’ve got one of the older versions, get the new one. It’s been updated, and we’ve added some cool checklists and stuff to it as well, so go to videopowerup.com to grab that.
Angela: The sign. The do not distrub sign. This says distrub, but it’s disturb.
Scott: It’s been corrected in the latest version. That’s actually really handy. That was Angela’s idea. Can I see that?
Scott: This was Angela’s idea, and if you work in a busy place or you’ve got kids, or husbands, or wives, or … Well, dogs can’t read it, but it was just a really good idea where you can just tape this on your door so people know not to come in, that you’re filming. This is just in the guide, and you can just print that out and hang it up on your door or your windows so people leave you alone when you’re doing videos. I thought it was a good idea.
Angela: Yeah, or enter quietly. Like I work from home a lot and so sometimes my family drops by, my mom, or … Not so much my sister, but my mom drops by, and if this is on my door, then she won’t open the door yelling, “Hello?” Right? Which is what is normal to do. Then she’ll come in quietly because sometimes you’re in the middle of filming and even when you’re on a roll, or if you’re live, that can really throw you off. That’s part of the guide as well.
Scott: Yeah, and the checklist, I know Angela wants to try and get through everything today. I really don’t think we’re going to have time to get through everything, so we can at least get through the nine steps, and want to just touch on the nine steps that will improve the quality of your videos, and we’re trying to be pretty speedy as we go through this.
Angela: Yeah, we will. If you guys have any ideas or if you have or have not read the guide and implemented anything, and it has worked or not worked for you, we want to hear from you too. Amanda, I know that your live video is about different kind of almost news based stuff with travel, like you talked about Mexico and safety, and things like that. Let us know what works for you, what doesn’t work for you. We’re going to start with step one. Hair, makeup and wardrobe. Is it really important? How important is it? Well, it’s only as important as you want it to be. Hi, Julie. Welcome. Thanks for joining us.
Scott: Hey Julie.
Angela: Hey. We’re just talking about our video production guide, our nine steps, and the first one is hair and makeup, and wardrobe. What I always say is if you were going to speak in front of a crowd, how would you want to appear? That’s how you want to appear on camera, no different. You don’t want to look like someone else, you don’t want to look like you never look. You want to look professional, as it is whatever your field is. If you do fitness … If you’re a fitness instructor, yeah, then you can be in like those clothes, right? We got a lot of love just now. I love that. Sorry.
Scott: My two cents on appearance is the unfortunate reality of the way that we’ve evolved, and a lot of you probably know this, is that people pass judgment on us so quickly, just based solely on our appearance. Now that’s not fair of course, but it’s the reality of it. With most of your marketing videos, where they exist is at the top of your sales spots. These are people that don’t know you very well, and so they’re trying to understand, can I trust this person? Should I not trust this person? You’ve got about seven seconds to have a positive impression on these people, and the first thing they go to is visually, what do they see? Is their hair done? Is their clothes wrinkled? They’ll make judgements based on that. It’s really important to spend some time to make sure that your appearance is good, but like Angela was saying, depending on … It’s all about your target audience as well. Thinking about your target audience and what you’re communicating to them.
I don’t know if it was a picture that Amanda put up, or if it was an actual video that she was doing and I don’t know if she had a hula skirt on, or a Hawaiian …
Angela: Beside the toilet?
Scott: Coconut top. I don’t even know what it was, but it was a little crazy and wild, and what I’m saying is that’s okay. For me to be doing that this morning would be a little odd, so you know? You’ve got to think about that stuff.
Angela: I think our audience would enjoy it if you put on a hula skirt though.
Scott: Yes. Yeah, you know? We might get lots of [crosstalk 00:07:04]
Angela: I mean, really. Thumbs up for Scott putting on a hula skirt. Little hearts for that. Let’s go to step two. Stabilize your shot. This one is a big one for me actually, and I can’t watch … I’m just leaning over just to give you an example. I can’t watch videos where people are like all like … They’re like this and they’re talking, and the background is spinning, and I feel like I’ve got vertigo. I can’t watch it. Now I don’t know if it’s because I’m a video snob, because I’m a video producer. Sometimes I wonder, or does it bother you guys? Stabilization is critical. Critical, critical, critical. Use a tripod. You guys have seen what we use. Unless you have a really steady hand …
Scott: Yeah, and some people do.
Angela: … And don’t move. Like you can keep steady and not spin around. Always using stabilization. When we say stabilization, we say tripod. If you are moving around, there are things like there’s something out there called Smoove, which is getting complicated now, but it’s like a Gimbal for smart phones.
Scott: Yeah, they’re expensive too.
Angela: They’re expensive. I’m not getting into it, but if you are moving around a lot, it might be worth investing something like that. My point is to have your camera nice and steady. Ours is always on a tripod. It’s never going to move and I just think that makes … Especially for pre-recorded video. Live as well, but especially for pre-recorded video.
Scott: Yeah, and I know we don’t have a lot of time, but there is some situations like live, and I know a lot of our clients do this as well. When you’re live and you’re at a specific event, like say you’re at a concert or an event, you’re probably not going to have a tripod with you. Even if you did, you’re not going to want to pop it up at a live event.
Angela: That’s true.
Scott: If there’s a situation like that, where you’re somewhere and it’s important to go live, just go live. It’s absolutely fine, but given the options, especially with these pre-recorded marketing videos or live videos that you’re doing out of your home, out of your office, if you have the opportunity to stabilize it on some sort of tripod, I’d recommend absolutely doing it because you don’t want people to be distracted. You want them to be focused on you, and your message. Step number three is …
Angela: Hey, Kathy just joined us.
Scott: All right.
Angela: I want to say hey to Kathy. Oh my gosh, I’m not even going to say what … I’m going to miss her. She’s moving.
Scott: No. Oh wait, that’s right.
Angela: Yeah. Yeah, I’m going to miss you.
Scott: You don’t have to miss her. She’s not moving to like a different country though.
Angela: I know, it’s not like you’re moving to like Katmandu, right?
Angela: I’m making such a big deal of nothing really.
Scott: Towards Huron, right?
Angela: Sandra is joining us today. Hey girl. Much love to you, how you doing? Yeah, she’s not moving far, thank God. Step three, shoot all your marketing videos in proper orientation. I don’t want to take up too much time, because I could with this one. I still feel like most of the time it should be landscape, because you can repurpose landscape videos for so many more things than you can repurpose portrait mode.
Scott: Absolutely, yeah. We learned something really interesting the other day, and Facebook keeps changing everything. Obviously this morning we’re live, and there’s two of us live, so the obvious choice is to go landscape. I’ve seen people go portrait mode, when there’s two people …
Angela: They’re like squished together.
Scott: They’re like squished together, and it’s just silly. Just turn the camera sideways, but make sure your camera’s turned sideways before you hit that go live button. We learned that on … I think it’s one of the new updates with Facebook, is that if you’re going live on your personal page, you no longer can go landscape, which is really odd.
Angela: It was weird, I was at Hayden’s lacrosse game, and I was streaming it live for the people in my family who couldn’t come, because it was his very last minor lacrosse game of his life. I was more upset than he was about that, so I was streaming it, and I couldn’t stream it in landscape on my phone, but I could do it on yours.
Scott: I know, and they roll out these changes.
Angela: On different devices.
Scott: Everything is constantly changing, and that’s why a lot of the videos we’re going to be doing, we’re going to have to keep updating them because they keep changing all the rules about how things are done. Anyway, so that was portrait versus landscape.
Angela: That was portrait versus landscape. We can’t not say this though. Once you start filming in one, portrait or landscape, don’t switch it. That’s a big no no. In most cases you’ll end up sideways. Then the other thing is always know where your audience is, right? I mean if you’re just using that video on social media, on Facebook, then portrait is okay, but then you can’t repurpose it as well and have it look as professional other places. Knowing where it lives and the only place it’s going to live, I mean just consider those things. The subject, platform, and repurposing.
Scott: Instagram, and I haven’t spent much time with Instagram. I know some of you guys have. Are their videos … They’ve got to be square, right? I think their videos are probably square.
Angela: I don’t know, Sandra, do you use Instagram? Maybe you can answer that.
Scott: Anyone who’s watching, let us know, because we’re going to start doing more Instagram videos in the fall, because we’ve got to get into it, but I think those videos might be square videos. I’m not sure, but we’ll find out. We’ll do some experimenting with it.
Angela: Step four …
Scott: Step four.
Angela: Properly framing yourself in the shot. This is another … Again, I don’t know if it is a pet peeve of mine, or if you guys know what I’m talking about …
Scott: Yeah, square.
Angela: Oh, Sandra says, “Yeah, square for Instagram.”
Scott: Thanks, Sandra.
Angela: Yeah, thanks. I am really … I like when people are center or just off center, and eye line to the camera. When I say eye line to the camera, like for us, my eye is here and the camera is right there. The camera is not way up here, and I’m not looking this way. The camera is not here and I’m not looking down. I’m looking fairly straight. I mean we have a slight height difference.
Scott: It is useful to download the guide. If you don’t have the guide, go to videopowerup.come and you’ll see it on the page. I know everything is backwards here, but here’s framing, the proper framing, hair cut in the top, you don’t want to do that. Then you can see, here’s an example of eye line. You want that lens on your camera. That lands right at your eye line. You can be a little bit up. You can come down at a little bit of an angle, but you don’t want to be … You don’t want to have any dramatic angles, because that changes your message.
We don’t have time to cover all of that, but properly framed. Angela and I are pretty well properly framed as far as haircuts. I’ve almost got a haircut. I’m taller than Angela, so that’s where we would frame that. Our shoulders are about the same distance from the edge of the frame. I’m surprised, and not everyone has an eye, and I know that about photographers. Photographers just have an eye. They just have an eye for things. Not everyone has that, but you do need to learn how to balance your shot, but I’m surprised at the number of people who don’t seem to pay attention to that. Pay a little attention to balancing your frame so you’re properly framing that shot. If it’s two people, balance those people.
Angela: Yeah, and we’ve seen actually if we still have Kathy and Sandra, and Julie and Amanda on right now, I’ve seen your videos, and you’re all fine by the way. You all do very different things. I know Amanda is usually doing something at her desk. Kathy sometimes is in the kitchen. Julie, I haven’t seen actually too many of your videos except for the ones I’ve filmed for you, but the ones I have seen where you’ve got like two chairs, love that. She’s a little wider in that one, but there’s an interesting background, so it’s okay. Sandra, same thing. You’re not too close, you’re not too far, and I think you do yours in portrait as well because a lot of it’s Facebook live that I’ve seen of yours.
Scott: Which is okay. It’s definitely okay to do portrait. Step five, what’s in the background of your shot? This is the advantage to doing something like this, is there’s no distractions. You can just look over our shoulders. There’s absolutely no distractions at all, which means your viewer’s attention is going to be on … It’s on us, it’s on what we’re saying. You’re not looking at the background. Angela really likes Maria Forlio.
Angela: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Scott: Angela watches …
Scott: Is it Marie? Maria Forlio’s videos.
Angela: I love that set.
Scott: She always has beautiful sets. They’re wider shots and you can see her, I think from the ankles up. You might even see her feet.
Angela: All pre-recorded by the way.
Scott: Yeah, they’re all pre-recorded videos.
Angela: All pre-recorded.
Scott: It’s beautiful. She’s got a beautiful home. It’s a beautiful set to shoot in, but there’s no distractions.
Angela: She’s like a size zero, so she always looks amazing. Not that your size makes you look amazing, but I’m just saying.
Scott: I think the main point of step number seven is just be aware of your background, like before you record, look in the background. What do you see? Is there a lot of distractions? Is there a lot of clutter? If you can clean it up, clean it up, or pick a different angle. The flat walls are boring, and that’s why we’re not quite happy with this. It’s going to work for today, but we’re going to do a bit more experimenting as well, because we do want to shoot it in our office. We don’t want to shoot it in our home.
Angela: The only other thing I want to talk about background, and is this a background topic, or is it a lighting topic? If you’ve got a lot of light in your background, there’s two things you can do. Cover the light or diffuse it, or bring more light to your front. That will help as well. Setting up a light. I don’t know if you guys know, but we …
Scott: Which is step six.
Angela: Make sure your lighting is balanced. There you go. Did we miss that step?
Scott: No, we just talked … Excuse us for a moment. We were just talking about the background.
Angela: I’m getting ahead of myself. Great.
Scott: Just making sure there’s no distractions in the background.
Angela: Yeah, and then lighting. That’s so funny that that’s the next thing I went to.
Scott: Then lighting. Step six is lighting, you know? Focus on your lighting. We’re not talking about artificial lighting necessarily, but just making sure your face is lit properly.
Angela: What I was saying is sometimes you can’t help that there’s a window behind you when you film. It just makes it hard … Not a nice glow. There’s a nice glow that you can use the light for, but if you get some light on the front, it will help that or like I said, if you just cover that light with something or diffuse it. We used to … Well, we still have very expensive studio lights, and we’re not using them. We never use them for these live videos, but we do have two lights set up and I think they cost less than $100 for the daylight balanced light, which means you can mix it with daylight and it won’t turn a weird color, is the best way for me to explain that. We’re going to put a link below after we’re done with the live, to the lights.
Scott: Yeah, well we’ll put a link … There’s a blog post, and we’ve got in this blog post are these lights with some description. Then also some sound equipment, and we’re going to talk about in a bit if you do want to improve the quality of your sound as well. Yeah, I’ll include a link to that blog post if you’re interested in looking at those lights. As a professional video producer and having worked in the film business, when Karen Clark put me onto these lights, and I got them, ordered them. I was still skeptical, but I love them. These are my favorite lights now, and they cost me less than $100 when my other kit cost almost $2,000. These lights are great, and I highly recommend them, so watch for that link to that blog post.
Angela: Yeah, the stands are a bit cheap, but I don’t care about that. Compared to our $2,000 stands. I mean there’s a difference, but that’s the biggest difference I notice. The other thing with lighting too, is don’t film in the dark. That sometimes when you get all that light behind you, that your camera makes you so dark, so that’s one of the reasons. Sometimes people actually film in the dark and it’s really fuzzy and like Scott said, people are going to judge you in the first few seconds. In the first few seconds, if they can’t see your eyes clearly and your facial expressions clearly, and get that know, like and trust factor right away, they may not watch you unless you’re really entertaining. Unless you’re pure entertainment. Step seven, I’m going to let you do step seven.
Scott: Step seven is basically sound. Now the sound recorder that’s built right into your smart phones, if you’ve got a late model phone, within the last three years, the sound recording quality of your smart phone is absolutely incredible. Again, I’m blown away by the technology that they’ve squeezed into these smart phones. If you’re in a quiet environment like we are right now, the audio recorder that’s built right into your smart phone is probably all that you need, but if you do want better audio, you do have some choices. Again, I’m going to post a link to that. Your main choices are getting rid of background noise, but even before we get into that … See, I’m skipping over things now too, it’s a lot of information we’re trying to cram into one live episode.
Before you record, just listen. What do you hear in the background? If you can hear the kids watching TV in the other room, or if you can hear a faint radio on, or maybe someone is cutting the grass in your front yard, eliminate those noises before you go live or record your video. That’s the first thing. The first thing is eliminating any background noise that you can hear. We have an air conditioning unit in this room that we run and then right before we go live, we turn it off because it’s really loud and the vent is right above our heads so you can hear it. We turn that off so it’s as silent as possible in our room when we record.
There is some equipment that you can get, and there’s sort of three types of mics. There’s the Lavalier, which clips on. I hate them. I don’t hate them. I dislike them. They don’t look … They bother me when I see them in a shot, and I don’t know why. I don’t know if that’s the filmmaker in me. I don’t like seeing audio recording equipment. Also the quality of the sound is very guttural. It’s very throaty, which isn’t natural. It’s not how we have conversations with people, so there’s that wired Lav, and it goes right and plugs into the phone. There’s a wireless, and I do recommend …
Angela: Sorry, the wired Lav is great if you’re far from your camera. Like if you were really far from your camera.
Scott: No, wireless.
Angela: Wireless, sorry.
Scott: The next thing I was going to say is your other option is a wireless Lavalier mic.
Angela: Right, yeah.
Scott: Would you like to talk about that?
Angela: Yeah, no. You go ahead. Sorry.
Scott: The other option is a wireless mic, which I do recommend for some people like Kathy. You always come to mind for me, like people who are working in a kitchen where you’re often turning your back to the camera. Now you probably can’t hear what I was saying there, but if I had a wireless Lav on, you could. Same with personal trainers where the camera needs to be much further away so you can see someone’s full body. You will need a wireless mic for that. My favorite is a shotgun microphone, which is really directional. It points the sound right at the subject, so that’s what we’re using today is a shotgun mic. It’s not taking any sound from the street. It’s only taking sound from here, whereas the built in mic takes everything, the ambient noise. Anyway that’s a lot on sound. I didn’t mean to talk that long about sound. Again, there’ll be some links in that blog post.
Angela: Yeah, and one quick tip, before you go live … Well mostly for live video with sound, before you go live, just do a quick … You can do live to yourself, and if you guys don’t know how to do that, just message me or post later, but you can do live just to yourself, so go live just to yourself or just record a video and make sure that the sound that you hear back is great. Just like five seconds before you’re going to go live, just do a quick sound test.
Step eight, to me this is an energy step. Having really positive energy before you film, because it’s hard for some people. For me it’s hard to be on camera and to put myself out there. I’m not an in front of the camera person, although here I am. To really know your material, get your energy up, be focused … I actually put a sticky, like I cut a little sticky note and I put it above where the camera lens is. I’m not looking at myself here, I’m looking up here, and there’s a sticky note to remind me that’s where I look, because that’s where you guys are. You are behind the camera. If I am filming and I’m looking at myself the whole time, first of all I’m just going to be self critical, but if I’m focusing on the lens, I’m focusing on you guys and not on how I look. Having that positive energy really helps me.
Scott: Yeah, and for me … This is probably something I’m going to add to the next version of the guide, step eight is like right before you’re ready to go, getting your energy level raised up, being positive and focusing on your audience, what I’m finding, because I’m doing these live videos almost every week now, is that there’s still that sort of panic as I’m getting things ready, what are we talking about right before.
Something I’m going to implement is getting ready five minutes early, like getting everything ready, testing everything and it’s all done, and I’ve got five minutes just to relax, maybe sip on my coffee, and just chill out for five minutes. I don’t want to be heading into my Facebook lives with negative energy, because minutes before I went live, I was kicking over a lighting stand and I ripped a hole in my chair as I was sitting down today. Anyway, that’s another story. That was what happened, and then I hit go live, and now I’m carrying that energy into my Facebook live with me. That’s not good. I’m going to start giving myself a few minutes prior to sort of calm down my energy and be positive, thinking about what’s the best way I can serve you guys, how can I help you guys the best. Step nine, the final step.
Angela: Oh my gosh, this is the hard one.
Scott: This is critical. Step nine, you have to take action. So many people that we know of downloaded our guide, read our guide, did some of our training and …
Angela: Filmed their video.
Scott: … And filmed their video too.
Angela: You know who you are.
Scott: They don’t take action. They don’t actually post it. Some don’t shoot the videos, but others shoot the videos and then don’t post them. This is so critical that you absolutely have to take action and get these videos out there working for you. I think everyone should be posting videos at least once per week. Maybe not 30 minute long lives, but at least two minute little marketing videos to give some valuable information to your target audience.
Angela: Yeah, and we talked about two minute marketing videos. I think I want to be really clear, and most of you guys who know us know what we mean, but two minute marketing videos aren’t sales videos. They’re not buy my stuff, look at my products. They are information that will help your target audience in their lives somehow, that will help them some way so that when they are ready to buy, you’re top of mind. It’s not so that you’re like buy, buy, buy, buy, buy. It is more these two minute marketing videos that you want to pre-record and put out every week, every two weeks, whatever it is, are real value based in addition to your live videos. You want to do a bit of both, because you want these nice, short, sweet things, and you want these longer ones. If you film them and you don’t post them, you’re not doing anyone any good. You’re not doing you any good as a business owner, but there are people that you have to actually help and you can contribute to bettering someone else’s lives by not posting that. You’re now not helping them. Think about it that way.
Scott: Yeah, absolutely. Anyway, that’s the nine steps to the guide. That’s what I really wanted to go over today, and I want to do something else, and this is unplanned.
Angela: What you going to do?
Scott: What’s that?
Angela: What you going to do?
Scott: You don’t know, do you?
Scott: Facebook has evolved so quickly, so before we wrap this up, I just want to try something because I don’t know what’s going to happen with this, but did you know that they’re getting rid of Facebook groups, the app for your phone? That’s fairly recent news. They’re going to take groups, that separate app and they’re going to move it back into Facebook, so I’m trying to read up on news. I’m trying to keep on top of it because it moves so quickly, but there’s a little button on the Facebook live that I’m wondering if it’s similar to what you get on your personal page. It’s a little magic wand, so I’m going to click on it.
Angela: Oh, you’re going to click on the magic wand?
Scott: Then it looks like we’ve got some filters.
Angela: Oh, yeah.
Scott: Country. That’s horrible.
Angela: That’s … Why? Why would you do that?
Scott: I don’t know. Looks like I can draw on the screen, which is kind of cool.
Scott: Then here’s probably the crazy one. What is this?
Angela: That’s just like … I don’t know.
Scott: It’s downloading something.
Angela: Can you put a cat on my head though? Maybe you can do that.
Scott: This and that. I think these are just weird filters and stuff.
Angela: Yeah, what are you doing?
Scott: I don’t know.
Angela: Someone stop him.
Scott: Oh, I disappeared. I don’t even know what’s happening right now.
Angela: I don’t know.
Scott: I’m going to get out of this. I’m going to get out of the magic wand.
Angela: It’s still …
Scott: I know. It’s going to stay there now.
Angela: Can you erase it?
Scott: No, there’s probably a way. Anyway, that’s all we got for today. We walked through our guide. Again, the link to that guide is on our page, or just go to videopowerup.com and I’m going to post a link to that blog post. What else did I say I was going to post a link to?
Angela: The audio, the lighting. In the back of the guide, we … Also again, it’s going to be backwards, but we have a production checklist, so before you film you can just make sure you’ve done everything. A going live checklist, which is great.
Scott: We might go through those next week, because they’re really cool, these little checklists. Got anything else?
Angela: Pages manager has stopped.